[Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

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[Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

Dr. Sassafras
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan

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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

luciash d' being

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

Bernard Sfez-3
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

Jean-Marc Libs
+1 for reasons stated by Bernard

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Bernard Sfez <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

Torsten Fabricius-4
+1 aswell (just tried)

objection: how to mass-update on existing sites/wikipages where the to-be-deprecated plugin is in use?

ideas?

update/upgrade script?

regards,
Torsten


On 16.02.2017 02:38, Jean-Marc Libs wrote:
+1 for reasons stated by Bernard

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Bernard Sfez <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

Dr. Sassafras
While it shouldn't be an issue making an upgrade script, but it may be safer to do it by hand. Im thinking this plugin is also mostly used on x.tiki.org.

I would be happy to just it mark it as deprecated, so we know to develop/use the tabs plugin. A full migration is a different issue I think.

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 11:41 AM, Torsten <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 aswell (just tried)

objection: how to mass-update on existing sites/wikipages where the to-be-deprecated plugin is in use?

ideas?

update/upgrade script?

regards,
Torsten



On 16.02.2017 02:38, Jean-Marc Libs wrote:
+1 for reasons stated by Bernard

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Bernard Sfez <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email][hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

Dr. Sassafras
luciach: are you talking about linking to the tab, or linking to items under a tab, both or sometime else? Perhaps it can be introduced to tabs?

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 2:13 PM, Brendan Ferguson <[hidden email]> wrote:
While it shouldn't be an issue making an upgrade script, but it may be safer to do it by hand. Im thinking this plugin is also mostly used on x.tiki.org.

I would be happy to just it mark it as deprecated, so we know to develop/use the tabs plugin. A full migration is a different issue I think.

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 11:41 AM, Torsten <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 aswell (just tried)

objection: how to mass-update on existing sites/wikipages where the to-be-deprecated plugin is in use?

ideas?

update/upgrade script?

regards,
Torsten



On 16.02.2017 02:38, Jean-Marc Libs wrote:
+1 for reasons stated by Bernard

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Bernard Sfez <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email][hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

Bernard Sfez-3
In reply to this post by Torsten Fabricius-4
Good point and answer can be used for other cases.

Can’t we add a transition notice ?

IE: For version 17, we add a small notice in the deprecated plugin itself that display a warning.
Note: This plugin has been replaced with : … please update as it won’t work for our next release (ok wording necessary but you got the idea).

Ideally we should have it for one version but people are jumping so may be 2 versions ? (ti could be good it include a LTS)

Bernard
















On 16 Feb 2017, at 04:41 , Torsten <[hidden email]> wrote:

+1 aswell (just tried)

objection: how to mass-update on existing sites/wikipages where the to-be-deprecated plugin is in use?

ideas?

update/upgrade script?

regards,
Torsten


On 16.02.2017 02:38, Jean-Marc Libs wrote:
+1 for reasons stated by Bernard

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Bernard Sfez <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email][hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

luciash d' being
In reply to this post by Dr. Sassafras

Hi Brendan and all +1-ers :),

couple of questions:

  1. With https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions?tikiversion=version+2 nor https://doc.tiki.org/PluginTabs#contentuser_tabset_01-3 it does not scroll down to the tabs in my Chrome - could that be fixed?
  2. With Versions plugin you can also use PluginParam syntax like this: {PARAM(tikiversion=7)}__This is information for version 7 only__{PARAM} on the page. You cannot do that with PluginTabs as there is no URL param for that... Also you can more easily link to display the version information using the Foo?tikiversion=2 where with PluginTabs you need to copypaste that ugly anchor link with semantically unrelated string "#contentuser_tabset_01-3". Could "tikiversion" or "version" URL param be added to PluginTabs to support that?
  3. Could the separator ---(foo 1)--- and ---(foo 2)--- etc. be added to PluginTabs? Then I would be fine with deprecating the Versions plugin...
  4. Also with PluginVersions you can completely hide the tabs and display only the version relevant information on the page where with PluginTabs you cannot do that. See https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions?tikiversion=version+3#More_Examples - it makes even sense that the anchor link is not added there now when you want to link to #More_Examples anchor... How would you do that with PluginTabs?

Thanks for listening to me,

luci


On 16.2.2017 10:25, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
luciach: are you talking about linking to the tab, or linking to items under a tab, both or sometime else? Perhaps it can be introduced to tabs?

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 2:13 PM, Brendan Ferguson <[hidden email]> wrote:
While it shouldn't be an issue making an upgrade script, but it may be safer to do it by hand. Im thinking this plugin is also mostly used on x.tiki.org.

I would be happy to just it mark it as deprecated, so we know to develop/use the tabs plugin. A full migration is a different issue I think.

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 11:41 AM, Torsten <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 aswell (just tried)

objection: how to mass-update on existing sites/wikipages where the to-be-deprecated plugin is in use?

ideas?

update/upgrade script?

regards,
Torsten



On 16.02.2017 02:38, Jean-Marc Libs wrote:
+1 for reasons stated by Bernard

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Bernard Sfez <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

Torsten Fabricius-4
*listening*

So as far as I understand Luci, there is more a coinsidental similarity between 'Versions' and 'Tabs' (the tab view), but the main focussed functionality is too different t simply deprecate one.

If I understand Luci's added information right, the question to discuss would be rather to fix 'Versions' or to merge the two plugins than to deprecate one of them.

Right?

Regards,
Torsten

On 16.02.2017 14:09, luciash wrote:

Hi Brendan and all +1-ers :),

couple of questions:

  1. With https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions?tikiversion=version+2 nor https://doc.tiki.org/PluginTabs#contentuser_tabset_01-3 it does not scroll down to the tabs in my Chrome - could that be fixed?
  2. With Versions plugin you can also use PluginParam syntax like this: {PARAM(tikiversion=7)}__This is information for version 7 only__{PARAM} on the page. You cannot do that with PluginTabs as there is no URL param for that... Also you can more easily link to display the version information using the Foo?tikiversion=2 where with PluginTabs you need to copypaste that ugly anchor link with semantically unrelated string "#contentuser_tabset_01-3". Could "tikiversion" or "version" URL param be added to PluginTabs to support that?
  3. Could the separator ---(foo 1)--- and ---(foo 2)--- etc. be added to PluginTabs? Then I would be fine with deprecating the Versions plugin...
  4. Also with PluginVersions you can completely hide the tabs and display only the version relevant information on the page where with PluginTabs you cannot do that. See https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions?tikiversion=version+3#More_Examples - it makes even sense that the anchor link is not added there now when you want to link to #More_Examples anchor... How would you do that with PluginTabs?

Thanks for listening to me,

luci


On 16.2.2017 10:25, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
luciach: are you talking about linking to the tab, or linking to items under a tab, both or sometime else? Perhaps it can be introduced to tabs?

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 2:13 PM, Brendan Ferguson <[hidden email]> wrote:
While it shouldn't be an issue making an upgrade script, but it may be safer to do it by hand. Im thinking this plugin is also mostly used on x.tiki.org.

I would be happy to just it mark it as deprecated, so we know to develop/use the tabs plugin. A full migration is a different issue I think.

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 11:41 AM, Torsten <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 aswell (just tried)

objection: how to mass-update on existing sites/wikipages where the to-be-deprecated plugin is in use?

ideas?

update/upgrade script?

regards,
Torsten



On 16.02.2017 02:38, Jean-Marc Libs wrote:
+1 for reasons stated by Bernard

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Bernard Sfez <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

Bernard Sfez-3
In reply to this post by luciash d' being
Hi Lu,

Answers inline;


On 16 Feb 2017, at 15:09 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi Brendan and all +1-ers :),

couple of questions:

  1. With https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions?tikiversion=version+2 nor https://doc.tiki.org/PluginTabs#contentuser_tabset_01-3 it does not scroll down to the tabs in my Chrome - could that be fixed?

With my chrome : Version 56.0.2924.87 (64-bit) (Google Chrome is up to date.)


  1. With Versions plugin you can also use PluginParam syntax like this: {PARAM(tikiversion=7)}__This is information for version 7 only__{PARAM} on the page. You cannot do that with PluginTabs as there is no URL param for that... Also you can more easily link to display the version information using the Foo?tikiversion=2 where with PluginTabs you need to copypaste that ugly anchor link with semantically unrelated string "#contentuser_tabset_01-3". Could "tikiversion" or "version" URL param be added to PluginTabs to support that?
https://doc.tiki.org/PluginParam is spartiate mode… 
If i understand what it does, I wonder how we use that and if it is really useful.
(I guess I miss a use case)

(PARAM = isbeep)
  1. Could the separator ---(foo 1)--- and ---(foo 2)--- etc. be added to PluginTabs? Then I would be fine with deprecating the Versions plugin…
Could be an alternative as long as it don’t overkill the code.

But I’d like the idea of a transition mechanism. (like I described previously)
  1. Also with PluginVersions you can completely hide the tabs and display only the version relevant information on the page where with PluginTabs you cannot do that. See https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions?tikiversion=version+3#More_Examples - it makes even sense that the anchor link is not added there now when you want to link to #More_Examples anchor... How would you do that with PluginTabs?
… Re thinking it, look like there is confusion because of some overlaping option with the 2 plugins.

Tab is doing tab and it is doing it fine.
Version should be doing version (without creating tabs)

It could then be improved first to work with tabs

———

Thinking about this …
Actually we have {group()}, {lang()} and version look like one of them, many many plugins that do more or less the same: depending on the value of a pref display or hide content.

Why not have one plugin to merge them all ?

Kind of : 
*select the pref you want the value to be checked (dropdown: group, lang, timezone, free text… it is endless) 
*select value to display the content (a multiselect or input field to select per group of values):
  If group is selected show = (Admin, Registered, Customer, Anonymous) or If group is selected DON'Tshow = (Admin, Registered, Customer, Anonymous)
  If lang is selected show = available language
  etc

I know it sound like more work at first but Isn’t having a single plugin instead of (5 or 7) more maintainable ?
or I’m just overthinking it this friday morning… :D

Bernard

Thanks for listening to me,

luci


On 16.2.2017 10:25, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
luciach: are you talking about linking to the tab, or linking to items under a tab, both or sometime else? Perhaps it can be introduced to tabs?

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 2:13 PM, Brendan Ferguson <[hidden email]> wrote:
While it shouldn't be an issue making an upgrade script, but it may be safer to do it by hand. Im thinking this plugin is also mostly used on x.tiki.org.

I would be happy to just it mark it as deprecated, so we know to develop/use the tabs plugin. A full migration is a different issue I think.

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 11:41 AM, Torsten <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 aswell (just tried)

objection: how to mass-update on existing sites/wikipages where the to-be-deprecated plugin is in use?

ideas?

update/upgrade script?

regards,
Torsten



On 16.02.2017 02:38, Jean-Marc Libs wrote:
+1 for reasons stated by Bernard

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Bernard Sfez <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

luciash d' being

Hi Bernard,

well, of course, you could have everything (Group,Language,Param,...) merged into one MEGA-fluffy plugin that would do all the IF/ELSE tasks to display content, but then you are creating a programming language syntax than helping users to achieve something easily with simple syntax... the PluginList is already becoming something like that, overly complicated to write for normal users. I agree it is powerful but easy to write? Nope...

I think it is better they are separated... Sometimes you want to enable one but not the other. Sometimes one needs to be always validated (plugin approval), sometimes not - e.g. the LANG

But we are slightly off-topic already here from the PluginVersions...

luci

PS: if you want an example of PluginParam with PluginVersion cooperation we can have a Skype / IRC session or just have a look at the syntax code of https://doc.tiki.org/Look+and+Feel


On 17.2.2017 7:56, Bernard Sfez wrote:
Hi Lu,

Answers inline;


On 16 Feb 2017, at 15:09 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi Brendan and all +1-ers :),

couple of questions:

  1. With https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions?tikiversion=version+2 nor https://doc.tiki.org/PluginTabs#contentuser_tabset_01-3 it does not scroll down to the tabs in my Chrome - could that be fixed?

With my chrome : Version 56.0.2924.87 (64-bit) (Google Chrome is up to date.)


  1. With Versions plugin you can also use PluginParam syntax like this: {PARAM(tikiversion=7)}__This is information for version 7 only__{PARAM} on the page. You cannot do that with PluginTabs as there is no URL param for that... Also you can more easily link to display the version information using the Foo?tikiversion=2 where with PluginTabs you need to copypaste that ugly anchor link with semantically unrelated string "#contentuser_tabset_01-3". Could "tikiversion" or "version" URL param be added to PluginTabs to support that?
https://doc.tiki.org/PluginParam is spartiate mode… 
If i understand what it does, I wonder how we use that and if it is really useful.
(I guess I miss a use case)

(PARAM = isbeep)
  1. Could the separator ---(foo 1)--- and ---(foo 2)--- etc. be added to PluginTabs? Then I would be fine with deprecating the Versions plugin…
Could be an alternative as long as it don’t overkill the code.

But I’d like the idea of a transition mechanism. (like I described previously)
  1. Also with PluginVersions you can completely hide the tabs and display only the version relevant information on the page where with PluginTabs you cannot do that. See https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions?tikiversion=version+3#More_Examples - it makes even sense that the anchor link is not added there now when you want to link to #More_Examples anchor... How would you do that with PluginTabs?
… Re thinking it, look like there is confusion because of some overlaping option with the 2 plugins.

Tab is doing tab and it is doing it fine.
Version should be doing version (without creating tabs)

It could then be improved first to work with tabs

———

Thinking about this …
Actually we have {group()}, {lang()} and version look like one of them, many many plugins that do more or less the same: depending on the value of a pref display or hide content.

Why not have one plugin to merge them all ?

Kind of : 
*select the pref you want the value to be checked (dropdown: group, lang, timezone, free text… it is endless) 
*select value to display the content (a multiselect or input field to select per group of values):
  If group is selected show = (Admin, Registered, Customer, Anonymous) or If group is selected DON'Tshow = (Admin, Registered, Customer, Anonymous)
  If lang is selected show = available language
  etc

I know it sound like more work at first but Isn’t having a single plugin instead of (5 or 7) more maintainable ?
or I’m just overthinking it this friday morning… :D

Bernard

Thanks for listening to me,

luci


On 16.2.2017 10:25, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
luciach: are you talking about linking to the tab, or linking to items under a tab, both or sometime else? Perhaps it can be introduced to tabs?

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 2:13 PM, Brendan Ferguson <[hidden email]> wrote:
While it shouldn't be an issue making an upgrade script, but it may be safer to do it by hand. Im thinking this plugin is also mostly used on x.tiki.org.

I would be happy to just it mark it as deprecated, so we know to develop/use the tabs plugin. A full migration is a different issue I think.

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 11:41 AM, Torsten <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 aswell (just tried)

objection: how to mass-update on existing sites/wikipages where the to-be-deprecated plugin is in use?

ideas?

update/upgrade script?

regards,
Torsten



On 16.02.2017 02:38, Jean-Marc Libs wrote:
+1 for reasons stated by Bernard

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Bernard Sfez <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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Re: [Tiki-devel] Depreceate Versions Plugin

Bernard Sfez-3
Right another discussion ! :)

Thanks for the use case.

Did you try my solution to have it using the PARAM plugin ?
Work for you ?

What you think about :

… Re thinking it, look like there is confusion because of some overlaping option with the 2 plugins.

Tab is doing tab and it is doing it fine.
Version should be doing version (without creating tabs)

It could then be improved first to work with tabs

Bernard

On 17 Feb 2017, at 11:43 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi Bernard,

well, of course, you could have everything (Group,Language,Param,...) merged into one MEGA-fluffy plugin that would do all the IF/ELSE tasks to display content, but then you are creating a programming language syntax than helping users to achieve something easily with simple syntax... the PluginList is already becoming something like that, overly complicated to write for normal users. I agree it is powerful but easy to write? Nope...

I think it is better they are separated... Sometimes you want to enable one but not the other. Sometimes one needs to be always validated (plugin approval), sometimes not - e.g. the LANG

But we are slightly off-topic already here from the PluginVersions...

luci

PS: if you want an example of PluginParam with PluginVersion cooperation we can have a Skype / IRC session or just have a look at the syntax code of https://doc.tiki.org/Look+and+Feel


On 17.2.2017 7:56, Bernard Sfez wrote:
Hi Lu,

Answers inline;


On 16 Feb 2017, at 15:09 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi Brendan and all +1-ers :),

couple of questions:

  1. With https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions?tikiversion=version+2 nor https://doc.tiki.org/PluginTabs#contentuser_tabset_01-3 it does not scroll down to the tabs in my Chrome - could that be fixed?

With my chrome : Version 56.0.2924.87 (64-bit) (Google Chrome is up to date.)


  1. With Versions plugin you can also use PluginParam syntax like this: {PARAM(tikiversion=7)}__This is information for version 7 only__{PARAM} on the page. You cannot do that with PluginTabs as there is no URL param for that... Also you can more easily link to display the version information using the Foo?tikiversion=2 where with PluginTabs you need to copypaste that ugly anchor link with semantically unrelated string "#contentuser_tabset_01-3". Could "tikiversion" or "version" URL param be added to PluginTabs to support that?
https://doc.tiki.org/PluginParam is spartiate mode… 
If i understand what it does, I wonder how we use that and if it is really useful.
(I guess I miss a use case)

(PARAM = isbeep)
  1. Could the separator ---(foo 1)--- and ---(foo 2)--- etc. be added to PluginTabs? Then I would be fine with deprecating the Versions plugin…
Could be an alternative as long as it don’t overkill the code.

But I’d like the idea of a transition mechanism. (like I described previously)
  1. Also with PluginVersions you can completely hide the tabs and display only the version relevant information on the page where with PluginTabs you cannot do that. See https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions?tikiversion=version+3#More_Examples - it makes even sense that the anchor link is not added there now when you want to link to #More_Examples anchor... How would you do that with PluginTabs?
… Re thinking it, look like there is confusion because of some overlaping option with the 2 plugins.

Tab is doing tab and it is doing it fine.
Version should be doing version (without creating tabs)

It could then be improved first to work with tabs

———

Thinking about this …
Actually we have {group()}, {lang()} and version look like one of them, many many plugins that do more or less the same: depending on the value of a pref display or hide content.

Why not have one plugin to merge them all ?

Kind of : 
*select the pref you want the value to be checked (dropdown: group, lang, timezone, free text… it is endless) 
*select value to display the content (a multiselect or input field to select per group of values):
  If group is selected show = (Admin, Registered, Customer, Anonymous) or If group is selected DON'Tshow = (Admin, Registered, Customer, Anonymous)
  If lang is selected show = available language
  etc

I know it sound like more work at first but Isn’t having a single plugin instead of (5 or 7) more maintainable ?
or I’m just overthinking it this friday morning… :D

Bernard

Thanks for listening to me,

luci


On 16.2.2017 10:25, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
luciach: are you talking about linking to the tab, or linking to items under a tab, both or sometime else? Perhaps it can be introduced to tabs?

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 2:13 PM, Brendan Ferguson <[hidden email]> wrote:
While it shouldn't be an issue making an upgrade script, but it may be safer to do it by hand. Im thinking this plugin is also mostly used on x.tiki.org.

I would be happy to just it mark it as deprecated, so we know to develop/use the tabs plugin. A full migration is a different issue I think.

On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 11:41 AM, Torsten <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 aswell (just tried)

objection: how to mass-update on existing sites/wikipages where the to-be-deprecated plugin is in use?

ideas?

update/upgrade script?

regards,
Torsten



On 16.02.2017 02:38, Jean-Marc Libs wrote:
+1 for reasons stated by Bernard

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Bernard Sfez <[hidden email]> wrote:
+1 to deprecate PluginVersions


Look they have the same goal but tab do it better/smoother.

https://doc.tiki.org/PluginVersions do a refresh of the page and move you away from where you were - back to the top (and that’s look awkward in 2017)


———

IMO link are better handled with PluginTabs

It is easy with PluginTabs (copy the link on the tab) and the url will directly get to the content of the tab (no need to scroll to find the tab)
With PluginVersions you will get at the top of the page with the tab open. If the tab is not shown right away (big page), it doesn’t really make sense for a visitor to have a link to a tab open he can’t see.

Bernard


On 15 Feb 2017, at 10:18 , luciash <[hidden email]> wrote:

-1 - it is different imho - you can link to it easily while to the TABS you can't - good for the doc site


On 15.2.2017 9:14, Brendan Ferguson wrote:
Can I get a few +1's or -1's for deprecating the versions plugin?

It does the exact same thing as tabs plugin, but reloads the page when you click on the tab. I played around with it and cant see how ANY of its options make sense to use, aside from the defaults, and they certainly cant do more than plugin tabs.

Im thinking of placing a deprecated tag in the documentation, pointing people to the tabs plugin.

Brendan


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